fertilizing pasture?

[wildwoman]

Do you fertilize your pastures? if so what with? (NPK ratios) and how long do you leave your horses off it after?
Thanks
Lisa

[cutiepiepmu]

Hi Lisa - I am ou tin Port Orchard, so a little close to your neck of the woods YES YES YES I fertilize! I am the QUEEN of fertilizer!! LOL the key is to get a soil test done to figure out what you need to do to balance your ground and help the grass root deeper ands tronger. Most of the soil around here is VERY acidic - making it a bugger to get solid good pastures. When we tested it was recommended tilling 3-5 TONS of lyme per acre - but, since we didn't want to wreck our pastures for the next two years and have the dusty mess - I went another route. I purchased a Lime solution that is liquid. I apply in the fall HEAVILY. It soaks in ASAP so really only a day or two of removal time especially if we have had good rains.

I also Use an extremely HIGH nitrogen fertilizer 4 times a year. I have been using a 21-14-7 pelletized agriculteral fertilizer sold through Dels. Works GREAT! I spread heavier than recommended as long as we are going to get good solid rain - otherwise you need to water, water water. Generally I am using about 6 - 50 pound bags per 1.5 acres put on with a tow behind agricultural spreader. How long I leave the horses off depends on conditions. I generally pull my horses anyways during the soggy months - we have winter turnout areas so that the pastures don't get beat up. During other times of the year - If we are having HEAVY rains after - generally a week off is fine - if I am watering I try to go 2 weeks and make sure that the pastures are VERY saturated. I don't want to see any pellets as I walk around the pasture.

The other thing that helps is to get a tow behind chain/stake drag. This will rough up the surface and help aireate it. it will also spread any manure around which is good for the pastures. I do this every time before fertilizing. I want my pasture to be pretty scratched up - then I apply the fertilize. During the spring, I do this HEAVILY - apply an 18-18-18 starter fertilize then Overseed the entire pasture areas with a very good pasture mix grass seed. After everything is put on, I flip my drag over so that the spikes are facing up and use the smooth chain side and go back over the pastures. Helps settle the seed into the soil so you loose less to birds Then I water water water water!!! It is always a good idea to mow your pasture VERY short before doing this particular thing. Helps the fertilize and seed go down where it needs to be!

THEN - lol - during the winter months - I do a monthly application of Ferrous Sulfate to help control moss. You can use something like moss Out, but it is cheaper and just as effective to use the pelletized ferrous sulfate(available again at Dels or Strohs - more expensive there!)

I will actually be applying my last seasonal application of fertilize this weekend. i think the winter fertlizing is almost the most important. It gives the grass the food it needs to stay strong over the winter and gives it a BOOST in the spring.

If you are battling weeds(like I am!) It is good to do an annual application of WEED MASTER liquid spray to the pastures BEFORE fertilizing. You will want to do this about 3 weeks before you fertilize once the grass is growing strong. It kills pasture weeds without hurting the grass. It is spendy - but it works OUTSTANDING!

For all chemical applications I pull the hroses for at least 30 days - although it says there is no withdrawl period. I don't like to risk it and since we rotate our horses anyways between pasture - it is no big deal to pull them off.


Make sure you USE your manure. Scatter it in your pastures. If you have a lawn tractor - use an old chainlink gait and put a pallet or two on it for weight. It will break up the manure and spread it around

When we moved to our property out here 2 years ago - the pastures had been continuously mowed to be 2 inches tall. Looked pretty - but had RUINED the pastures. We basically had to start from scratch. If you have a big area you are trying to rehab - pick 1 or 2 pastures a year rather than your entire area. That way - you have turnout still, and can keep the horses off the areas youa re working on until it gets going again

Sara

[cutiepiepmu]

ohhh and because we are only about 5 minutes from gig harbor - if you want to come out and see what we do - you are welcome any time

Sara

[pnp4kidz]

ARgh, if we only had water to WATER, and flat to drag...
we rely on rain, and for things to stick on the hill...
I'm looking at tractors now, but on the hill, it scares me.
Is there anything to put on to kill the low growing weeds? we have nothing but dirt right now, but last spring all we grew was weeds! even tho we seeded, the seeds just never seemed to grow...
how does THAT happen?

[cutiepiepmu]

Weedmaster is the BEST - get a tow behind sprayer that has swing out booms - get one to go behind a lawn tractor or ATV. They are the most practical. Also - you can get a 4ft chainlink gate cheap ro free on craigslist pretty often. turn it sideways(long ways) then tie a rope in a Y shape to each corner and tie to the lawn tractor - that works GREAT as a drag if you don't have a tractor and is safer on hills. You may need to throw some wood pallets or some other kind of weight on it to weight it enough to be effective. Bungy those things onto the gate to make them stay

As fara s re-seeding hills - one of the biggest things to do is first- get the weeds under control - THEN, you mayneed to add top soil or a peet/top soil blend HEAVILY -THEN put the seed on it, drag lightly over, then WATER LIKE CRAZY!. Use a garden hose with rain bird type sprinklers to water. SEveral hardware stores sell the ones thata re designed to water on low pressure systems. I set up and water all night long. The idea that you need to water 20 minutes a week is STUPID. The ground here does not allow for teh grass roots to penetrate deeply, so if you don't water heavily and often, the grass dies. ALSO - when you re-seed - you need to pull the horses off of teh area for at least 3-6 months until the grass is 8 inches tall and does not easily pull out by the roots. Pulling them off for a full 12 months is even better. During the inital re-seeding you need to be watering DAILY in order for the grass to root. Quality fo seed is important too - find seed that germinates quickly and is designed for your kind of soil. Tall Fescue(endocyte free) as well as certain types of clover can germinate quickly and hold teh base for the slower growing grasses like timothy, orchard grass, brome to go ahead and take hold and grow. Especially in areas that have a harder time - like hills or rocky soil - you need to look for HARDY grasses. I prefer some clover in my pasture mixes. It adds nitrogen back to the soil and tends to be alot hardier than most actual grasses. It can fill in the spots where teh grass has a harder time- give back to the soil - and improve condition of the area long term. Adding a good starter fertilizer that is an 18-18-18 is important as wel since it helps germinate and grow the seeds a little faster.

keep in mind that inital seeding you will be using ALOT of seed. It should completely cover the ground - generally 200 pounds of seed per 1/2-3/4 acre or so. It won't be cheap unfortunately. BUT - if you take care to do it right, pull the horses off so it can get started, and go through all the BS of dragging hoses and whatnot - the area will get established and give you years and years of good area for grazing if managed properly!

Sara

[pnp4kidz]

Well,, we have the 'time off' built in, since it is such a hill, if the horses go there in winter, it is one big mud slide.... so we sacrafice our pastures and deal with folks who don't 'get' that horses can survive in some mud.... argh... the horses don't mind actually, and learn to 'mud ski' on our paddock hills... scary!

I buy a grass seed pasture mix made for our specific area from a grass seed company, and have bought 'extra' by their standards for about three years going... but that comes to like 40 lb! I have about 1.5 acres, maybe 2 in front when we crop out the paddocks, and the arena, and another 2.5 in the back now....

we have a great little truck/dump/pull vehicle, called a Trekker, and we can go on some of the hill with that, and do a drag... and we compost our poo, so have great quantities of that by this time of year, and it is wonderfully composted.

What I do NOT have is water! we buy water, and 3500 gallons costs me $210. I get a load per week when my well is dry, which it was this year by May.... It 'might' come back by December or January... but then I don't 'think' it produces 'extra'... but we get by.
I could put drip lines down there and buy extra water for times when it doesn't rain that week, but we're talking expensive for grass!!!

I was hoping for something to put down first to kill the weeds soon, pre-emergent?
then put down seed after the first rains, and pray it keeps up a good schedule...
but maybe I need to think more fertilizer, and also way more seed. I get a nice mix usually, I get natives mixed with clover and some fast sprouting in there plus some that reseed well in our area.

argh, I ought to move, huh?

[pnp4kidz]

Oh, and I have to assume by June my grass will all die and be eaten down to dirt. Right now, they live on dirt. Nothing growing at ALL out there... anything that grows after rain will grow from seeds, nothing left to have any plant now, so I don't try to get year round pasture, not possible, but a nice 4 months would be good... :-)

[cutiepiepmu]

WOW! Out of curiosity - have you checked into drilling a well at all? We are getting ready to put in a second well with a new system that doesn't require the normal bladder and holding tanks. It is a VERY cool deal! Total cost will be $12Kish - we figure we will need to drill around 200 feet down to get good clean water with good pressure. Looking at how much it costs to buy water - if you were to even do a personal loan, heck you would cover the costs of your water 10fold in a short time.... Just a thought.

I knwo that in that area down there you risk hitting geothermal and ending up with warm water - which you cant irrigate with unless you put in a holding pond area to let it cool first. But MAN - once you figure in how much extra you are paying for hay and water - if you had a second well that was deeper and could water from - it would allow you to irrigate, have grass during the entire summer, cut your hay costs and eliminate the need to buy water...

I don't envy you!!! You MIGHT want to consider graveling the hill, then putting top soil over then seeding. Would open it up to the root growth some and also get rid of the mud problem. if you use something like a 1inch minus or even a 7/8 minus that was compacted i would figure it would give good results. Since moving I have learned ALOT about rock lol. We have about a full 2 acre area that surrounds our barn, house, driveway and garage buildings -along with between all gates, under all run in sheds and behind my barn for the stall runs that is assorted kinds of rock. In the last 2 years we have hauled in around 1200 yards and spread it!! CRAZY stuff!

Also - try planting about 50% clover on the hill - or more even. Clover is DURABLE stuff. It needs to ber warm enough for it to germinate and grow at least a little, so don't wait until too late in teh season to seed. Also -certain types of clover can haver toxic effects - so be really careful as to the type you choose - no RED clover for sure. BUT - it might give your hillside the boost it needs.

Sara

[pnp4kidz]

Wow Sara you are the gravel QUEEN!
well, we have lots of gravel... in paddocks, around the house, in gate areas... with carpet underneath! that holds the mud down to a low roar... for a while.
Our well is at 300 ft hunny... and that produces a 'solid' few gallons per minute on a good day.... during wet season. right now, I'm guessing 50 gal per day...
we have a 'dry' season, and a 'wet' season... sucks.
when it rains, it pours, literally, days and days and weeks on end... pouring down...
and it is cold when it rains here... down to the 30's at night, and when it's raining it is rarely above 50 ... so forget planting when it is warm... warm = dry... cold = wet.
we have specific grasses that even TRY to grow here... ug.

so, I onlly dream of irrigated pasture...
and low hay bills.

thanks tho, I'm going to try to plow under the weeds, and reseed in a few weeks right after a rain... and pray for more rain after that... then a warm dry spell to sprout it, then more rain...
can I rent a native american for a rain dance?

[wildwoman]

Hey-thanks guys-we have 5 acres here-(2 main pastures, 3 smaller ones and an area yet to be cleared)-at least the guy who we borrowed the backhoe from came and fixed it when we killed it.
Joe and Krissie have access to the two main pastures as the field fence dividing that needs to be restrung after Joe took a headder jumping it-once I get that back up and hotwired again it will be fine. The new addition to the family is needing "quiet time" alone-so is in the area that is 50x90ish. I am afraid if I put Joe and Kris on either side of her they will get her all riled up-but OMG it is funny watching their antics. Joe likes to herd Kris and I SWEAR TO GOD he was lunging her today-he had her going in circles when she could have taken off and gone ANYWHERE else. I need to get a video camera.
SO
I think I will try and spilt the main pastures back apart and do one of those as well as the back corner pasture and then tackle something else next year.

Sara-we are on the pierce/kitsap line and across the street is P.O. address. I would love to come see what you do.
Thanks
Lisa

[cutiepiepmu]

LOL - we are ALSO on the pierce kitsap line lol We are the first house inside of the kitsap line on Wright-Bliss lol. Sounds like we must not be all that far apart!!

Sara

[wildwoman]

we are on 94th where it turns into Sidney-ok so last night I "googled" our address and the first thing that comes up is the map then hit "satelite view"and you get an arieal view OMG THAT IS FREAKIN COOL! you can zoom in pretty good-I showed my husband and he narrowed it down to what specific week 3 years ago the image was taken by the details. it REALLY emphasized how much land we have that hasn't been cleared and being used (A LOT!) and will help me decide where to put the round pen-he wants to keep the barnyard area open.

[pnp4kidz]

Oh goodness...
we have 7.6 acres and use just about every square INCH of it!! LOL!! I can't even imagine 'uncleared land' being in my vocabulary!
can we send you a retiree??? PULEEESSEEE? :-)

[wildwoman]

Hey we JUST fenced in an area that is approx125x150 that WAS cleared and he had to MOW it ummmm DUH-well "the former resident" (one of the more PC things we call his ex) wouldn't allow it to be fenced


we are also needing to redo a LOT of fence cause apparently whoever built it in the first place did not have horses-or at least one that is used to being "self sufficient" as I refer Joe :-)
they had the 2x6's nailed from the outside-so if you are INSIDE the fence and push-they pop right off-so now we are screwing the 2x6 rails up from the inside.

[wildwoman]

OK Sara-and just how do we keep the birds from enjoying the new buffet? Our rider needs to go in the shop-so I am hoofin it out there with the drop spreader.

[cutiepiepmu]

Keeping the birds at bay is the hard part. What I have found works well and doesn't require the clean up that using straw or other things is to firsrt - REALLY rough up the surface - Second - spread a moderate amount of starter fertilizer for SEED - make sure it is the kind that is safe for seed or it will fry your seed - THEN - lay out the seed. The key is to make sure you put out enough that if the birds eat 1/3 you still have good thick coverage. I have NEVER said to myself - I wish I had put out less seed lol. THEN - afte ryou put the seed out - drag back over the seed to work some of it lightly into the soil - we are not talking digging it in,but it needs to have soil contact to germinate - and rolling it around int eh dirt makes it less desireable to the birds it seems like. THEN -you need to water the DICKENS out of it - even if we are getting a little rain every day - get sprinklers going. If you need help getting set up off a regular well system or city water system let me know - I have a setup that I use that works well and involves ALOT of small diameter regular hoses(smaller diameter means more pressure in the line - can run more sprinklers) and then I use sprinklers that are designed to cover a broader area. I generally set them up to run 24/7 for the first 7 days after I HEAVILY re-seed. I move the lines every 3-5 hours depending on water flow. After that period - most of the seed will START to germinate as long as it is warm(this is a SPRING TIME thing!) AND - the water helps put the seed into the dirt some as well so makes it not as appealing to the birds

We have 18 acres here and and have 1 more pasture that needs SERIOUS work - the rest are just yearly improvement kind of thing now - but i have spent MANY MANY hours out there working on it.

Hey - WW - depending on when you want to do it, I MIGHT be able to load up the small lawn tractor and our tow behind spreader and help you. Seriously - doing it with a drop spreader is HORRIBLE. Not only do you go back later to find areas you missed - but you will want to bang your head into a tree by the time you are done lol. I have an agricultural tow behind broadcast spreader that is outstanding I use it for seed and fertilizer. Was the BEST anniversary present lol. We have our good mower that we use for the lawns - but I also have this little Murry riding mower - looks like the redneck mower supreme - but, it has NEVER failed me - lol even when the motor mounts came out and it puked its own mower out into the field - it kept running lol!! I use the tractor when I pull the serious drag that has the spikes - it is HEAVY. But, when I scatter poo, spread fertilizer or seed - I just use my handy Murry mower

OHHH do you need compost?? LOL I have MORE than enough to share - lol. Even after we spread this fall we will still have around 90 yards or more.... I MIGHT be able to even deliver since you are so close - we have a dump trailer luckily!

I am rambling - today is my "day off" so to speak and I am avoiding going to the grocery store lol!

Sara

[cutiepiepmu]

OHHHH and check out GOOGLE Earth..... THAT is cool!!! Similar to what you have seen, but you can get REAL TIME pictures! Super cool!!!

Sara

[wildwoman]

Our little ghetto ride on needs to go to Lonnies for God only knows what.
Sara-I swear to God you must be the "Martha Stewart" of farm management.(ok minus the jail time part) seems like it would take a small army to do all you do. I am supposed to be putting together a wedding album for some clinets and here I am again.
Where did you get your lime? someone told me there is a place on the tideflats in T-town that you get it by the ton.

[cutiepiepmu]

Well - I am buying a liquid lime solution - When you just add the powdered or pelleted type to the surface it isn't all that effective unfortunately. Generally you need to till it between 12-24 inches in order for it to be effective. You should apply lime in the fall though so it has time to break down over the winter. I buy it by the 50 gallon drum then use an ag spay spreader(rented one before - but am hoping for this years anniversary I will get one myself!) The company that makes it is called Get-A-Lawn.

Don;'t know about Martha - lol. I grew up on a BIG ranch so kind of came by it naturally I suppose. Plus - my honey is a BIG believer in - if we need it more than once - just buy the dang thing! LOL Our stuff is not fancy - it is amazing what you can work with being creative. Chain link gates and rolls of chain link fence if you have a tractor make AWESOME pastures drags. They chew up the manure and spread it around but don't trash your pastures in the process. I CAN say that one of the best investments we have made was our new tractor when we bought our property. It has been a GOD SEND! It saves so much time on so many things! LOL - plus, if you have issues getting the hubby to help do the chores outside - get some cool tools - lol. Seriously - he will be THRILLED to drive teh tractors, dig up stuff, lol...... He thinks it is fun - you get help and work done in the process!!! I just throw John up on the tractor, hand him a cold beer and let him have at it!

If I get the pelletized lime I just buy it by the bag from dels. They throw the bags on sale for $2 bucks in the fall. I don't use much of it so it works out fine....

OHHH WW - what do you know about wedding stuff lol. I am TRYING to get our wedding stuff figured out....

Sara

[cutiepiepmu]

Well - I am buying a liquid lime solution - When you just add the powdered or pelleted type to the surface it isn't all that effective unfortunately. Generally you need to till it between 12-24 inches in order for it to be effective. You should apply lime in the fall though so it has time to break down over the winter. I buy it by the 50 gallon drum then use an ag spay spreader(rented one before - but am hoping for this years anniversary I will get one myself!) The company that makes it is called Get-A-Lawn.

Don;'t know about Martha - lol. I grew up on a BIG ranch so kind of came by it naturally I suppose. Plus - my honey is a BIG believer in - if we need it more than once - just buy the dang thing! LOL Our stuff is not fancy - it is amazing what you can work with being creative. Chain link gates and rolls of chain link fence if you have a tractor make AWESOME pastures drags. They chew up the manure and spread it around but don't trash your pastures in the process. I CAN say that one of the best investments we have made was our new tractor when we bought our property. It has been a GOD SEND! It saves so much time on so many things! LOL - plus, if you have issues getting the hubby to help do the chores outside - get some cool tools - lol. Seriously - he will be THRILLED to drive teh tractors, dig up stuff, lol...... He thinks it is fun - you get help and work done in the process!!! I just throw John up on the tractor, hand him a cold beer and let him have at it!

If I get the pelletized lime I just buy it by the bag from dels. They throw the bags on sale for $2 bucks in the fall. I don't use much of it so it works out fine....

OHHH WW - what do you know about wedding stuff lol. I am TRYING to get our wedding stuff figured out....

Sara[a href="http://[del:cutiepiepmu]"]http://[del:cutiepiepmu][/a]

[wildwoman]

Weeeeelllllllllllll
as a matter of fact-i have been a wedding photographer for 20 years(so I have seen about everything) and got married very recently myself.
We rented the GH Yacht Club for the reception-was about the only place that
1) would hold all our guests and-
2) would let us bring our own caterer-I already had a wedding booked for the son of a caterer for summer 09-so we are trading. There are other places that can accommodate larger numbers-nice if you want an all inclusive food/facility package-BUT-watch out-they throw out drinks right and left, someone sets a drink down to go dance or visit etc-so they have to pour more (they charge by the glass poured) Ok so maybe I should email you seperately or this whole thread will go COMPLETELY off track.eeek

[wildwoman]

ok so google earth just showed me the same picture from 3 years ago-still cool-but not updated for this address.

[cutiepiepmu]

Bummer about google earth! We are actually thinking of ditching the family all together lol. It is SOOOOOO complicated between his side and my side. We were thinking about getting married on the beach or on a dock at sunset in Antigua The family is throwing FITS though so we were talking about doing a live web cam(mare stare offered to host!!) so that everyone could "be" there lol.

Out of curiousity - what did your wedding cost? John and I have been going rounds about the cost of weddings - He can't seem to understand why they cost so much lol. He thinks for a few hundred - and at MOST a few grand we could have some big ol shin dig lol. NOT!


Hey - do you do pictures in general? I am wanting to get some of John and I and maybe a few with me and the horses(the sexy kind lol) for john for christmas !!

Sara

[cutiepiepmu]

Ummmm last threat was supposed to go PM LOL not exactly sure why it ended up here - BUT I figure I am too tired to figure it out tonight!!

Sara

[wildwoman]

The "average" spent on weddings is $28,000-let your hubby know that, and you my dear, although I do not know you, HARDLY seem "average" I think FIRSTLY you should determine what is most important-so many things one can spend on weddings just because 'it's done that way'
What about you and John doing your thing privately in Antigua and then planning something back in the states to celebrate?
there are Seattle photographers that charge in the range of $10,000+-I think I need a branch office in Seattle.
number of guests?, what you are wearing?, location?, eating?, listening to? etc, how long do you have to plan? It is actually cheaper to buy your tablecloths than rent if you order early enough. etc.........
we made fused glass as gifts at reception, had a live band, an artist that painted and sketched during the ceremony, and an AMAZING balloon guy at reception, I wore 2 dresses, and hubby bought a new tail coat-but he wears a tux at various events so that can be used again. BUT.... we did a lot of things that helped keep $$ in check-bartering for catering, and my dad went to Ocean Shores and bought dozens of crab and oysters (although I am not sure the caterer was on board with that idea LOL)
my sister did the flowers, I did the cake,Jon made the programs, we made reception decorations, oh yeah-I hadn't sewn in YEARS and I decided "OH BOY A WEDDING! I can make dresses!" so yeah I made 5 dresses for bridesmaids/flowergirls. We also did without the alcochol-hubby is a teacher and we'd invited several students and didn't want any liability issues.
Oh yeah and we had it on a Sunday-several locations and vendors can negotiate $$ if not on a Friday or Saturday.
Basically people who know and love you want to be there to witness the happy event-they want to feel important enough to be included and share-really-what's the fun in life without things to plan for and celebrate?-and seriously-weddings have been UP this year-I think people really do need this when all else looks gloomy.
BUT #1 thing-DO WHAT YOU WANT-everyone else should be there to support THAT end.
#2 HAVE FUN

[cutiepiepmu]

LOL - Well - John won't even begin to tolerate a big - "to do" kind of thing. He doesn't want a band or a bunch of flowers or all the traditional stuff. For him the thought of people celebrating "HIM" freaks him out lol. lovely huh? A friend of his a long time back had like 10 family memebers and friends adn went out and stood on a big rock at snoqualmie falls - in their jeans - and got married. Cost? Taking everyone to dinner - LOL Not my thing AT ALL - but that is what john wants - so we are trying to find some kind of middle ground. What is funny - I am SURE my engagement ring had to be around $25-$30K ish.... lol. It freaks me out to wear it because I am afraid I will either get mugged or mess it up/loose it!! LOL

I really like the idea of getting married - just me and him - in summery/flowy clothes at either sunset or sunrise - in antigua. Plus - the resort I am looking at is amazing. We would get our own cottage that is amazingly furnished, our own buttler and chef at our beck and call - and be able to do TONS of activities on the island. It is a really beautiful place and very romantic. The web cam idea really appeals to me too simply because I like the idea of NOT stresing john out with the whole 500 or so people that would need to be there lol. Just family is over 250!

i HAVE to get john to stop watching "my big redneck wedding:" on CMT LOL Geez.... We are SOOOO not buying our wedding attire at wal-mart in the hunting department!! LOLOLOL

Your wedding sounds perfect to me

Sara

[wildwoman]

UMMMM Sara........... may I be so forward as to ask-......just WHAT exactly does your sweetie DO for a living, betcha he's NOT a teacher!..... and did he follow the "2 months salary" guideline? (ok where is the shock and awe smiley?)
I vote for you guys doing what YOU want and have a reception when you get back. Hell-just throw a big party-One couple this year that didn't want traditional wedding cake had an ice cream truck pull up outside the reception., another was a fruit display designed to replicate cake-HAVE FUN WITH IT-and do something unique
I would have been happy just 'gettin er done', but Jon wanted to stand in front of God and all creation and the whole nine yards-by the time we incorporated a lot of the elements that personalized it-yowza! best man's son sang during candlelighting, Trumpet processional(best man and a groomsman), his opera singing daughter singing while we lit candles and signed documents and the band at the end playing "all you need is love" for recessional-the other groomsman was in the blues band that played at reception. we had fun-but it all goes so fast, the main thing is AFTER and THE REST OF YOUR LIVES TOGETHER-I remember seeing on Oprah about how many gals spend YEARS planning the "perfect wedding" they don't give a single thought as to after.
And to answer your earlier question-yes-most of what I do is environmental portraiture-people in their own environment celebrating their lifestyle-comfortable and unique-storytelling.